Hi guys,

Jorge is quite correct, however, there is great potential for the operating system changing in the next few years (3), and unless you are prepared to run a dedicated computor, you are out in the cold. On my current project it is getting to the point where you have to run a dedicated planning server. In fact it has become so complex, you need several dedicated servers, like for instance document control, etc.

Where were the days, when the planner used to administrate the server/system under Novell (dos), with a 510 Mb hard drive, that was in 1994.

Regards

Philip

Hi Jorge,

Nice to hear from you on this site. I hope you still remember me.

I’ve asked this earlier in this thread. Maybe you have a better answer for this question.

"Does it mean everytime Microsoft develop and release a new Operating System in lieu of the current one and this OS is not compatible with the current Primavera version, Primavera has to change it’s platform as well?"

What I mean by changing platform is like what happened to P3 3.1 and P3e. From Btrieve 16 bit to Oracle etc. 32/64 bit. What will happen to P3 5.0 if, in ten years time Microsoft will release a new OS which is not compatible with P3 5.0?

I know this is only hyphothetical question now but I believe this is worth looking at by planners. 10 years ago, no one predicted what will happen with P3 1.1 when we were using it in splendido.

Thanks and best regards,

Se

P.S. regards also to abby.

Vlad, believe me , I went crosss eyed

Sigfredo. it doesn’t mean that. Microsoft Vista is a new level of operating system - compare it to the jumps when DOS went to Windows, and when Windows 95 came out (which was the last MS update of comparable importance). Primavera’s current leading system is Primavera 5, it’s a free upgrade if you are under maintenance, and it will run under Vista.

The legality issue regarding firing up an old project with the version of the software at the time it was backed up has been around for ever, I used to build taxation software, same problem there, it is not an issue, if you must use a very old version I’m sure someone (Primavera?) will have a copy they can help you with in a legal case. Plus I think most of the management consultancies (PwC for example) keep copies of most evoluitions of major software for precisely those reasons.

Of course, if you don’t have the software under maintenance and you decide to invest in Vista rather than staying with XP (or whatever system currently in use), then buying the new version of all systems that operate on the 16-bit standard is part of your investment.

Suretrak is 32-bit and as far as I know will run on Vista.

Philip,
I did not test P3e for the enterprise resource leveling. Do it because there was an unanswered question at http://www.planningplanet.com/forum/forum_post.asp?fid=&Cat=8&Top=13573&page=2 that can be critical. I hope that P3e can solve this not too complicated task but still try to avoid unpleasant surprises in future.
Best Regards,
Vladimir

Hi Bill and all you other guys,

I am on a large project, which is just kicking of and has to be completed by 2010, and have spent the last week getting seriously involved with Enterprise Project Manager, what Version 5 is called. After a week I have found out a lot. Obviously, the one question that remains, is the stability of the software. This will only be found out as we go along. Generally, the product is essentially similar to the old P3, but with a lot of add-ons.

The Import/Export facilities exist for more operations, but essentially the important one is for excel, for mass editing, when you now export from V5, it creates a database template, with a row of heading descriptions, which makes it easy to understand the database field headings. this row is marked for deletion prior to re-importation to V5, this is stuff we had to do manually before, so it a bit like database for dummies, it is a good feature, which is a major improvement. Also, it imports from MSP, in a simple no-fuss way, and sorts out the WBS structure, but not the old eternal problem of MSP activity numbering (in numerical, not text format). It can furthe import from P3 V3.4, but I have not had a chance to try it out, but by looking at the way it imports MSP projects, I guess this will work just as well.

As for it’s other features, I think most of the old P3 apostles can get into it in no time, despite of all the fancy add-ons, which gives you the options of doing old tricks in a new way. One of the essential differences, is changes in terminology, some for the better, and some which is a bit confusing, but understandable. For instance a barchart, is now called a Ghantt Chart ( the way I was taught), but a PERT is now called an activity network, where they refer to a PDM (again old terminology, possibly more correct, as PERT could be eithe PDM or ADM). However, the point that confuses old users, is that nowhere do the refer to sub-projects within the program, although they do so in their manual. After a bit of thought about this it makes sense to me as if you look at it, every portion of a project is a project in it’s own sense. Example, on a project, you may have different contracts, each with their own project managers. The hierachical setup of V5 allows you to setup these, so-called projects as projects on their own, and as it is a pyramidical system, allows you to take into account Contractors, and there so-called sub-contractors. So you can effectively, structure your project anyway you like it.

This is a brief overview, and Bill you will probably tell me I am defecting, but I am not, just greener fields.

We had to do an evaluation of the two products today, as time is few, and my thing is that there is greener fields, which, can be grazed. As to the question of stability, I think we have always had these problems, and learnt how to deall with them, by way of various fixes, and that is why we are planners. If I think of it it I had a few crashes on P3 a year ago. but Pfix could sort them out.

I had to take part in writing an evalution, of the two programs today, and unfortunately P3 V3.4, the old work horse, needs to be put in a nice green field, and used as a stud, quite a nice way of ending it.

Regards,
Philip

aGREE Oscar

And in the claims business, yo must be able to track projects and do so with creditibility.

You know you can do so with creditibility with P3 but to have to learn to do the wheel again??? And then go into court with a p3 v 5 and state yes I am a expert in p3 vrs 5 but its only been on the market for 1 year. daaaaaa

whereas with p3 3.1 you could go into court and say yes am a expert with 15 years experience in P3.

hmmmmm food for thought

Is it hard for Primavera of just making a patch to P3 so that it would run on 64/bit PC?

No, it’s not hard. It’s impossible.

Bernard Ertl
eTaskMaker Project Planning Software

HI PHILIP

BEEN ON R AND R AND NOW BACK IN THE SADDLE.

Apppears you have really chatted with p3 people and and think we old war horses now should shut up about 3.1 and learn 5.0 ????
Damm, hate to see it.

Any thoughts??

cheers Bll

Hi again,
I am seriously lookig at the alternatives, and have been for a while. Let’s talk about what we want....................

I would suggest to never use "compatible" as this means "almost" a "look alike".
P3 and P3e are called compatible, Suretrack and P3 are called compatible but not equal.
In P3 you have cost codes, activity splitting, resource curves and resource ,among other features not availabel in Suretrak, that result in your schedule differ with Suretrack.
With P3e you have resource leveling (not smoothing) while in Primavera Contractor you do not have any resource constraing feature, you have resource loading but no control on its allocation. The 700 activities limit is not just an arbitrary limit, it is dangerous indeed.
Sometimes the so called "Enterprise Stuff" is not what you really need, it is unempowering, it takes control away from people who need to have it. It is too expensive.
For desert I prefer to use a spoon rather than the bucket of a backhoe.
P3e after many upgrades is still a disaster and will ever be for those of us who do not need the enterprise features.

The issue is with new projects. You cannot specify a software (like P3) to be used on a new project if the operating system supporting it is no longer commonly retailed. New projects will be forced to specify Primavera 5.0 (or whatever new name Primavera chooses to com up with.)

of course... there is always the option of buying maint. agreements now, and then trading in for P5... where the remaining period of your maint. agreements will be honoured (judging by some of the posts coming in about it, you may be glad of them :o))
Would that be an overly cynical course of action?

Hi Oscar,

Yup you’re 100% right this is somehow a good software business. How to correct this, I believe competition is the answer.

Se

Hi Philip,

I think I’ve heard this before from Primavera when they released P3e. Please note in their statement now that they will stop support for 3.1 by year 2007 or "maybe" beyond. Please take note of the words maybe beyond. They also said that one of the reasons why they still support 3.1(not develop) is because of customer demand. Customer demand is still the bottom line here. Until they do really stop support, that’s the only time I will prepare my eulogy. For the meantime, Primavera should focus on making their products better than 3.1.

I’ll bring some flowers when we bury 3.1 and I will request a 21 gun salute from the US military.

After the funeral, I’ll be glad to be the godfather to a new baby. Definitely my new baby will not be P3 4.1. I’m now looking at P3 5.0, Powerproject or Spider.

BTW, I’ve seen the website of ASTA. Powerproject seems to be a good option.

Cheers,
Se

Hi Guys,

This makes sense a Primavera is already saying, that P3 will suffer a demise in 2007, so the old workhorse will be shot and killed.

Think about it, we will have to get a 1000 pipers together who can play the "Flowers of the Forest" on bagpipes, and bury P# V3.1.

This is a sad business, considering the fireman and others that died in 09.11

It is correct that Microsoft’s initial plans were for their next version of Windows (dubbed Vista), scheduled for release in either late 2006 or early 2007 would be 64bit only.

However, since then Microsoft has announced Windows Vista will come in three architecture flavors: a 32bit version, a 64bit version for x86, and a 64bit version for the Itanium processor. There will also be home and business categories.


I suspect this is because a 64bit version would require people to buy new hardware and there will not be many native 64bit applications intially to take advantage of the 64bit processor.

Vista 32bit will run 32bit apps natively. This should also run 16-bit applications like P3.

Vista 64bit for x86 will run 64bit apps natively and 32bit apps through the WOW or emulation layer. Note that this will not run full emulation, but will access the 32bit capabilities inherent in the processors.

Here’s an article talking about it.
http://www.windowsitpro.com/Article/ArticleID/47665/47665.html?Ad=1


Regards,
Bill

Bill

Thats what they said when we upgrade from Window 3.1 to 98
16bit to 32 bit. It took them few years to resolve all the problems.

You will expect a few years again or longer because Primavera is no longer develop P3 3.1

Cheers

Alex

Windows Vista (next generation of Windows OS is scheduled to be available in either late 2006 or 2007). This will be available in 64-bit and 32-bit versions, so 32-bit version should be able to run 16 bit software like P3 3.1.

Regards,
Bill