The Road to Recognition

Majority of Planning Planet members comes from UK influence line of thinking (basically, former colonies of the once mighty British Empire, now member of the Commonwealth Countries).



But, the once upon a time is not really the best thinking in the planning universe.

I have seen the website of AACE, and they do have a substantial amount of information, I believe, which is similar maybe the same, as what is being proposed here. Is there a difference? Just asking.



Would it be more beneficial if the 2 organizations collaborate on this?

The CIOB Guide will be in much more detail, and will form the basis for the education of project schedulers. It will also be the standard by which project schedules will be prepared, quality controlled, updated, reviewed and revised in practice. The guide’s draft contents is:



1 Introduction

2 Terminology

3 Types of schedule

4 Managing the process

5 Method statement (those in general relevant to programme preparation)

6 Preparing the schedule

7 Quality assurance

8 Progress records

9 Monitoring the schedule

10 Updating the schedule

11 Change management

12 Reviewing and revising the schedule

13 Reporting

We do need to be accredited and recognize as Planning and scheduling professional.



What do I have in mind??



Planning Planet Professional Planner and Scheduler.



WOW



What will be the difference with AACE Accredited Planning and Scheduling Professional???

Dave



PMP is a PM certification rather than a scheduling / planning accreditation.



In the 1970s the trend was to think that effective time management lay in the hands of Project Managers. In those days it was thought that the project manager, by defining relationships and managing people and information, could achieve what the QS and cost management alone could not.



However, it is clear that without competent project control and contracts that permit effective process management, managing people and information does not secure timely completion of projects.



Project Managers often do not understand how to use the schedule as a project management tool. Therefore PMP is not the solution I don’t believe



Regards



Toby

I still don’t understand what is fundamentally different about what is being proposed here and what other organisations already do. E.g. PMI.



"what existing certification bodies specifically give a qualification or accreditation in planning / scheduling?"



I would imagine the PMI would be mortified that you had not considered a PMP to fit this definition.



I am not suggesting that a PMP is the best possible qualification for a project manager. I am asking what is fundamentally different about this proposal and (for example) a PMP?

Hi David



I forgot to mention C&G Bricklaying 1961



Before MPEO my career has been an unqualified success.



Best regards



Mike T

But Mike...



I guess you, and your GCE ’O’ level carpentry is something that most of us haven’t got - does that make you (and it) special???

Hi All



I have contended in the PP forum that you cannot plan a project if you don’t know how to build it.



I raised this at Reading when Toby had the floor.



A degree in software manipulation will not automatically create a competent planner.



First demonstrate that you can build - then demonstrate competence in the software - then get planning accreditation.



I agree with David - The PEO is very nearly there and it gives accreditation by a panel judging a submitted thesis.



It is simple and it works.



Anyway an MPEO trumps my GCE carpentry O level any day.



Best regards



Mike Testro

Rod and all



As a member of the APM and an interest in the Planning and Programming SIG (and I have a great respect for many of the active members of the SIG). have you read their recent publication ‘Introduction to Project Planning’?



To be frank, I read the ‘book’ in about 15 minutes and have never read such an anodyne jargon-laden tome in all my life. With respect, if this is the best the APM can come up with (the Project Planning introduction has had a gestation period longer than an elephant) then I don’t think the APM is the ideal organisation for planners to be affiliated with. Fingers-crossed that the CIOB initiative bears more fruit.



Whilst the Planning Engineer’s Organisation has had a bit of a static period of late it is about the only place where there are some decent, topical and serious papers on planning and programming. Yes, the PEO is only two or three years old but if more of us get behind it, it could well become our natural home. The entry criteria, I think, are pretty fair too. As has been said on Planning Planet many times before passing exams and being able to drive software does not make you a good or competent planner and a global organisation cannot survive or grow with the need for face-to-face interviews.



And taking up what Toby says, the good universities in the UK do already offer planning modules as part of, say, their construction management courses. Our problem is to get those people into specialist planning and programming careers and not to loose them in to general project management and so on.



Regards



David

Oliver



It is hoped that other bodies such as APM and PMI will work with the CIOB to ensure that the accrediation is recognised across different bodies and organisations.



Keith Pickavance is involved with PMICOS, so is already aware of the work done by them, and will maintain the lines of communication. As earlier poster in this thread was on the board of the APM, so perhaps he can encourage them to get in touch with the CIOB on this issue.



There are also a number of Universities interested in looking at this as a possible module to an MSc or post grad diploma.



Regards



Toby

Toby,



I think that having a detailed CIOB specific planning standard that integrates contractually is a great idea.



However, having a CIOB accredited course, although global, will only hold any weight within the construction and possibly engineering sectors.



I think what is needed is a ’project control’ accreditation that (1) is universally recognized as guaranteeing the standard of the individual that holds membership and (2) can be used as a key reference document for all industries.



If a detailed standard was created by bodies such as the APM/PMI and recognized globally, then a supporting CIOB standard could be put in place to integrate planning best practice into construction contracts and indeed many other sectors.



In addition, i think that the planning community from the construction / delay sectors would play a key role if such a direction was taken, as from my experience there are still some sectors that are lagging behind in project controls.

Dave



what existing certification bodies specifically give a qualification or accreditation in planning / scheduling?



The CIOB is a global organisation, and the idea is that it works with other bodies and groups to make sure best practice is promoted in this field globally.



Regards



Toby

How is this different to existing certification bodies? Or is this because you want to have something UK centric?

Dear All



It would be worth you all reading the recent CIOB survey ’Managing the Risk of Delayed Completion in the 21st Century’. You can download a copy for free at www.ciob.org.uk/resources/research.



The research revealed that a high proportion of complex construction projects are likely to be finished more than six months late, due to poor time control. Amongst other things, those responding to the survey felt that very few projects are currently managed by reference to modern methods of time control, and that improved facilities for the education, training and accreditation of planning engineers and project schedulers are needed.



Following on from this,the idea is that to start with the CIOB (which already has its Royal Charter) will develop a "CIOB Guide to Good Practice in Project Scheduling"



The purpose of this guide is to set down the standards of project scheduling necessary in order to facilitate the effective and competent management of time in construction projects.



The recommended use of the guide is that it will form the basis for the education of project schedulers. It will also be the standard by which project schedules will be prepared, quality controlled, updated, reviewed and revised in practice. It should also be identified in contract conditions, project specifications, and bills of quantities as the required standard for the preparation and updating of construction programmes, progress reporting and time management.



Keith Pickavance, current President of the CIOB is heading this initiative up, and it has support from a number of leading industry players including Gary France of the PEO.



I actually spent a session at the recent Planning Planet conference speaking on this very subject, and if anyone wants a copy of my slides, please feel free to drop me an e-mail to tobyhunt@hillintl.com, and I will forward you a copy.



Regards



Toby

As a Director and Trustee of APM, can I suggest you get closer to the APM Planning Special Interest Group?

As APM will (hopefully) get it’s Royal Charter next year, an affiliation to a Chartered body will do you no harm at all.

Now is the time to structure what you think a Planning qualification could look like - you have a blank canvas.

Christian



Very good analysis, that could work as it defines the planners knowledge.

Planning Planet becoming serious? I think you need to re-baseline everything and consider some significant things like:



1. How does it feel to be called Planning Planet Certified Planner? (PP Admin, you need to change your image, you need to wear tie from now on! or you’ll lose some serious members - like me!).



2. face-to-face interview, and going global? (this is going to be Big Time! - how much is the membership fee by the way? is there a free tea or coffee?).



3. how about the free forum? (oh i really love this one!), i hope it remains free!



4. Are you going to put the PP Headquarters in China?



anyway, Congratulations! despite the global crisis, Planning Planet is becoming an institution (a serious one hopefully!)....where’s the bin?

Good One Chris,



But grading on basis of face-to-face interview is not at all a good idea. Then there is always a possibility that the expert will be bias.



Exam for 2 or 4 or 8 hours shud be fine to test on theoretical, practical and teachnical fronts just like EVP or CCE.



Cheers,



Rav

Hi there,



I missed all of this as I was out of the country on a job so taking each of the questions in turn.



(1) Do we need to be recognised / certified / accredited or graded?



I’m assuming that you mean a professional qualification like a membership of the Chartered Management Institute. Why not, it can only increase the credibility of planners, schedulers and project controls professionals. Different grades of membership according to qualifications and experience is fairly standard. Associate Member, Member, Fellow and if you want to get really posh Companion.



At the same time, though, you have to keep entry criteria fairly tight. Where someone has a reconised degree in Project Planning or something similar, let them have a basic membership. But at the same time don’t debar the person with no formal qualifications who has been doing the job for twenty years. Have your own exams for membership grades, maybe along the lines of PRINCE2 qualifications where you start off with the foundation qualification then move on to practitioner (the equivalent of Associate Member and Member maybe?)



Further progression through achievements, experience, further qualifications (professional, academic?)



(2) Do we need a professional body such as APM or PMI to do this, or should, or could we, organise and accredit ourselves?



It will need to be a professional body, with professional standards, but whether you organise a new one from scratch or tie in with an existing related professional body, I suppose would need a poll of the members. Asking what is probably a really daft question, don’t we already have such a body? The Planning Engineers Organisation or maybe that is a little bit too oriented towards planning without due emphasis on the other skills mentioned in your post.



(3) Irrespective of how such certification or accreditation is carried out, what Core Competences / Skills should be recognised and how could we grade such skills?



Possibly the first run at this would be to poll the members and find out what they see as their key skills. From this it should be possible to build the ideal skill sets for planners, schedulers and project controls professionals. The next bit is the really tricky bit, you need a team of highly skilled, highly qualified Planning Planet members in the various disciplines to map the skills from the skill sets to the different grades of membership. It takes a lot of time and a lot of effort.



(4) How can we assure the market / employers that such accreditation is unbiased and indeed accurate?



There isn’t any quick or certain way of doing this. What it needs, unfortunately, is years of employers finding that members of the Planning Planet affiliated professional body are very good at their jobs. Eventually this will lead to confidence that any member of this professional body will be able to do the job, and thus confidence in the accreditation and the professional body responsible. But it isn’t going to happen quickly, if you take a look at a brief history of the Chartered Management Institute, you’ll see what I mean.



Sorry this has gone on a bit but my excuse is I’m on sick leave fo another couple of weeks, and I’ve got time on my hands. If you think that this post is more trouble than it’s worth bin it.



Regards



Chris Oggham