Changes of Activity Relationships

Greetings for all

I think the best to follow up the up date by applying the information to the base line and to compare the resulte to the submitted updated schedule if there are any difference between the base line result and the submitted one the consultant have the power to let the contractor to clarify the different result

regards,

Changing relationship is very important if you do this in good faith and serve the purpose of the shedule, for the project team to use in their day to day activity. if not "just changing to hide something" , the shedule become un-meaningful. sooooo what to do......????

When performing TIA, would you not apply progress & notified changes to baseline? If so, un-notified changes would have no impact on the assesment?



Regards,



Gary

Gary:



I agree it is short-sighted, eventually most probably will backfire. But unfortunately some Contractors will do it as not all inspectors and owner’s reps are expert at CPM scheduling, if they perceive so maybe they will take the chance the job do not ends in court and eventually on the hands of forensic experts.



The Owner will expect the inspector and his rep. will raise the flag as soon it happens, otherwise he might believe them negligent and short of due care. Here a good utility will be of value.



In occasions while looking to solve issues on out-of-sequence the Contractor might even lose track of your own changes and forget to disclose. Here a good utility will be of value.

So what are the reasons a contractor would want to make changes without the client knowing?

Obviously any EOT claim would be analysed in detail vs the baseline so it can’t be that.

Is it just to get the client off his back during the project, hoping he can recover any delay before he’s found out? That seems short-sighted to me.



Rafael:

It’s not often I get called a gentleman, so thank you for that.

Arnold,



Thanks, your option, as well as Digger within P6 is not equivalent to the original Digger for P3, it is not an acceptable option for me. It seems that everything touched by the P6 developers gets rotten.



I will keep looking elsewhere.



Albert,



Follow the link and do a search on “claim digger”, “project management”, “ cpm scheduling”, "P6" ... maybe you will get lucky and find a few technical references. On the internet you will find a few interesting file sharing / hosting services for free. Just make a good use of these.



http://www.4shared.com/



Some files are in .rar file types for these you can download the free utility IZArc from their site.



http://www.izarc.org/index.html

Hi Rafael,



It works with me in P6.



If you are going to open the spreadsheet, it will prompt to "Disable or Enable Macros" & More Info.



1. Select the Enable Macros.

2. Select "Load XER file...and select the baseline programme.

3. When done, go to file & save as with different name.

4. Open again another file using parser & builder, this time, select the updated programme and save as..

5. You can compare the two file files using the Vlookup command in Excel.



Note: You must first open the baseline programme or updated current programme using Primavera window and export the project. This are the files that you are going to load to parser & builder.



Let me know if you have done it.



Regards,



Arnold

Hi Albert



For a 10,000 activities I don’t think so.. you would really need a digger to do the job easily, and the contractor is responsible to let the client know of his changes in order to expedite and/or do the job especially if those areas of concern would involve the client...

Arnold:



I downloaded the spreadsheet; it works with the outdated P5 format, does not work with the outdated P6.0 nor with its updates P6.1, P6.2 or in between Service Packs.



I got a listing of the database field values, the database tables, I believe.



Because the spreadsheet came with no instructions I wonder how it will manage an outdated 100,000 activities schedule P3 was able to handle and P6 insists it is not enough.

Shall I apply the spreadsheet to the two projects to be compared and then make a field by field comparison of each field? This would be somewhat insane. This cannot be it; can you give me some insight? Definitively I am doing something wrong.



Do you know how a Primavera P6 developer laces his right foot shoe? He stand up in front of a desk, put his left foot on top of the desk, keeps his right foot on the floor and then he bends to lace his right foot shoe.



I hope you understand my frustration, sorry don’t take it personal, blame it to me but don’t leave me in ignorance.

You are welcome.

Arnold,



Thanks. I just downloaded the file; at first glance using xer files seems like the correct approach.



Rafael

Hi Rafael,



Please follow the link:



http://knowledgebase.primavera.com/attachment/PATTLNK_632006_536-xerFil…



Albert,



We have a copy of P3 Claim Digger with Serial No. but I cannot give you because this is copyright materials owned by the company. Sorry for that.



Try to check at http://knowledgebase.primavera.com/



Regards,



Arnold

Arnold,



Although I am in the Contractor’s side I am interested in a tool for P6 that work as efficiently as P3 Digger. Eventually I might be forced to swallow P6.



Can you give me a link for "PATTLNK_632006_536-xerFileParser&Builder.xls". I do not have Primavera Support Contract and don’t believe I will ever pay for it unless a client implements a Network or Web installation.



You can use rapidshare.com free account to upload the file so we can have direct access to it.



Thanks in advance.



Albert,



You know the street; it is a jungle out there, maybe Garry is too much of a gentleman.

Albert,



If the contractor lies about changes to hide delay, he will be found out at the end of the project. and if he has changed the programme to make it look like client is responsible for the delay, it would be a simple matter to check the logic etc of the ’actual’ critical path for un-notified changes vs the baseline.

Gary



When I was working on my previous project The Engineer has implemented such system, there was an instruction to report on all changes made to the current updated programme (eg. added/deleted activities, modified relationships, etc..) and it has to be included in every update submission.. to me I see this as a benefit to the client and contractor..

For P3, P4/P6

http://scheduleanalyzer.com/sa_brochure.htm

For MS Project the following also provides a schedule comparison tool.

http://www.steelray.com/spa.php



Do any of you have these tools?

How they work?

I believe they should be better than the comparison tools supplied within the software.



Please note that while Claim Digger can handle Changes of Activity Relationships not necessarily Changes in Resources and Calendar Details when comparing differen versions (not baselines) of the same job.



I would have some reserves about the claims by the software vendors themselves the same way I would about the Contractor disclosing everything even under oath. I am law abiding, but in no way naïve. As a contractor those tools would be useful when making changes to the schedule specially when solving issues for out-of-sequence. Good to know, sure I won’t tell the Owner’s rep. I do have these tools, it is his responsibility to make sure we don’t cheat .................(law abiding, are you sure?).

Hi Gary,



That’s great idea..We need to follow the baseline programme without changing the logic of the update....etc.



Regards,



Arnold

I was thinking about this very topic the other day, for a client who is about to let a £100m+ project.



I was thinking of advising them to put a clause in the contract which requires the contractor to submit a change log with each programme update, detailing what changes were made (to logic, durations, planned resources, constraints, etc), the reason for the change, when the change was made, and who authorised it.



I’m sure the contractor won’t like it, but is there any legitimate reason to object to standard change control practices being applied to the programme? Has anyone used such a system before?



Cheers,



Gary

Hi Rafael,



As I am in the Consulting side, I am also facing some difficulties with regards to the comparison of baseline and updated. Our Contractor submitting the weekly report however, I cannot check all the changes they made.



What I did, I tried to use Excel sheet with the help of Visual Basic Application and the combination of Claim Digger and Microsoft Access. But it is not easy to do that.



Did you ever try this "PATTLNK_632006_536-xerFileParser&Builder.xls" you can use this as a reference for checking.



Regards,



Arnold

Arnold,



I do have MS Project but rarely use it; maybe I can figure it out if no response for this particular issue is posted.



Since I don’t have P6 I appreciate your response. I understood from your response that within P6 you can only compare jobs within a single database, this is not necessarily an issue, but I still have some questions about how to audit submitted files to make sure no unforeseen changes are introduced.



Suppose for a single job you have the monthly update for month no 6 and for month no 7 and you want to compare both files to make sure no hidden changes were made; to work hours, to calendar days, to resources and so on. I need to compare not only the baseline fields but logic, calendars and resources files. I believe that by naming differently the job versions you can load them to your database and compare one against each other but when you compare calendars and resources as well as other fields the report will tell you all are different. What if you compare two jobs exactly equal, the same version different name? The report should disclose there are no differences.



Sorry it is very difficult for me to express myself but all I got is memories from P3e various years ago plus some literature on P6. Because you are a P3 and Digger for P3 user having access to P6 you can make the comparison I am not able to do. To me it is of particular importance because as a Contractor if I know in no easy way the Owner will notice this could give me an advantage, it is good to know. Maybe I will even switch to P6, in this way most probably he will never know.

Hi Rafael,



With Digger in P3, there is a calendar & original duration option but in P6 doesn’t have, only duration.



In P6, only the project can be compared not the database.



Resource Assignment, cost & units can be compared between the updates and the baseline.



I am sorry, I am not using MS Project. I don’t have any idea.



Regards,



Arnold

Arnold,



With Digger in P3 you can pinpoint variations in workdays within each calendar. Can you do that within P6 and MS Project comparison tools?



With Digger in P3 you can compare updates beteween databases as each P3 Job is in a separate database. Can you do that within P6 and MS Project?



In P6, can the software pinpoint differences in your resources among different updates without getting confused and identifying all as different? Seems to me Claim Digger within P6 is strong at comparing baselines but not for comparing update file submissions.



These are questions that have been in my mind for a while; I would appreciate feedback from those knowledgeable of P6 and MS Project.

Hi Albert,



In P3, "Claim Digger" is a separate tool use to compare between the baseline and the current schedule.



In P6, this is already under the Tools --> Claim Digger.



Regards,



Arnold

Hi Albert,



Why don’t you use the "Claim Digger"?



Regards,



Arnold