For issuance of TOC, my company usually incorporates it on the milestone dates set in the contract. Partial taking-over for substantially completed works can be use for DLP.
Regards,
Ed
Member for
20 years 10 months
Member for20 years11 months
Submitted by Andrew Flowerdew on Mon, 2007-10-15 13:23
If the 33 sections are to be handed over in sections ,what are the logical sections have to be ready and completed to hand over and how many taking over cetificates can be issued for one project.
Member for
19 years 2 months
Member for19 years2 months
Submitted by ashraf alawady on Sun, 2007-09-09 09:08
The client has directed the engineer to agree with the contractor to certain proceedures and areas which can be logically accepted to make partially taking over.
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18 years 2 months
Member for18 years2 months
Submitted by David Barker on Tue, 2007-09-04 10:20
In the condition of contract ,it is stated that if any part of the permanent works has been substantially completed and has satisfactory passed any tests on completion prescribed by the contract, the engineer may after due consultation with the employer issue a taking-over cetificate in respect to that part of the permanent works before completion of the whole of the works in condition that the contractor shall undertake to complete with due expedition any outstanding works during the defects liability period for that part.
Member for
19 years 2 months
Member for19 years2 months
Submitted by ashraf alawady on Mon, 2007-08-13 10:39
To begin with, you need to obtain a ‘Relief from Maintenance’ for every section turned-over. Without this, any damage done will still be your responsibility to repair.
Next, you need to ensure unrestricted access to the remaining work sites. You also need to establish noise level and hours guidelines. You need dust and debris guidelines. You need power interruption guidelines.
Finally, You need to establish access boundaries so that no one not in your employ will access any part of the active work area (including your entrance and access areas.) Your insurance and bounding companies need to sign off on this agreement. Without this, you will find that you have voided your contracts and coverage.
Good Luck!
Member for
19 years 2 months
Member for19 years2 months
Submitted by ashraf alawady on Thu, 2006-09-28 07:05
If the sections havent been previously agreed then it would appear by the wording you stated that it up to you to agree them now. This may ease your problem, assuming the contractor plays ball and agrees to fewer sections.
No doubt he will be keen to handover the sections as soon as possible for the reasons indicated in my previous post.
How does the contract define sectional completion (if it does)? eg, taken into use by the Employer or similar. Something along these lines may help you divide the project into larger sections if 2 or 3 areas will not be used until all complete.
Member for
19 years 2 months
Member for19 years2 months
Submitted by ashraf alawady on Wed, 2006-09-20 09:50
I was deeply investigating all the contractsdocuments to find any more details and i got in the tender query and response the following-
"Partial havdover will be accepted by the client with sections to be agreed on site with the engineer."
Did the above give me any strong contractual support during my discussion and negotiation with the contractor for how to devid the project in to reasonable stages for handing over.
Member for
20 years 10 months
Member for20 years11 months
Submitted by Andrew Flowerdew on Tue, 2006-09-19 12:51
Totally agree. The sectional completion is probably more relevant to the Employer as it would have been the Employer for his own reasons, came up with the sectional completion requirements of the contract.
Member for
20 years 10 months
Member for20 years11 months
Submitted by Andrew Flowerdew on Tue, 2006-09-19 06:14
You can try and agree whatever you like with the contractor but as each section will pass from his insurance to yours and the issue of the partial completion certificate will possibly start the defects correction period running, I doubt (or would be very unwise to) the contractor will agree.
The contract states the deal that was made, now its up to you to carry that deal out.
Member for
19 years 2 months
Member for19 years2 months
Submitted by ashraf alawady on Tue, 2006-09-19 02:51
I need your opinion in the practicality of this process to issue 33 nos.of partial taking over certificates for one project and i said that itis contractually supported but i would like to draw your attention regarding the following:-
*To issue a paital taking over certifucate i have to do te following:-
1- Do my own inspection for the completed areas.
2- Be sure that all qualiyy tests have been done and tests results are in compliance with the contract requirements.
3- Be sure that a suitable corrective actions have been taken for any failed tests .
4- Be sure that no any major works are remaining or avoid the client form using the completed portons safely.
5- write my report and recommendations to the client.
*I have to call the client officially for handing over inspection for any completed portions.
*If the client accept my recommendation, I have to specify the handing over commitee which should include Clientsrpresentative,Engineersrpresentative and contractorsrpresentative .
*The handing over commitee shall inspect the areas to confirm wither those areas have been comlpleted to the satisfaction of the client or not.
*If the areas were ready, completed and accepted, the engineer has to issue a partial taking over certificate for those particular areas.
So is it practical to do all the above said proceedures for each completed area or we can agree with the contractor to devide the project to 5 satges (as example)for handing over so, we can reduce the nos. of partial taking over certificates and reduce the complecated process of releasing the retention amount,issuing maitanence certificates and other contractual proceedures
Member for
19 years 7 months
Member for19 years7 months
Submitted by Karim Mounir on Tue, 2006-09-19 01:24
Member for
19 years 2 monthsRE: Taking over of sections or parts
thank you Edderic,
in this particular project it was very wise suggestion to put a milestone dates in the contract for the areas needs to be handed over partially.
Member for
20 years 3 monthsRE: Taking over of sections or parts
Hi Ashraf,
For issuance of TOC, my company usually incorporates it on the milestone dates set in the contract. Partial taking-over for substantially completed works can be use for DLP.
Regards,
Ed
Member for
20 years 10 monthsRE: Taking over of sections or parts
Going on your last post, 33!!!!
Member for
19 years 2 monthsRE: Taking over of sections or parts
If the 33 sections are to be handed over in sections ,what are the logical sections have to be ready and completed to hand over and how many taking over cetificates can be issued for one project.
Member for
19 years 2 monthsRE: Taking over of sections or parts
The client has directed the engineer to agree with the contractor to certain proceedures and areas which can be logically accepted to make partially taking over.
Member for
18 years 2 monthsRE: Taking over of sections or parts
In Handover 5 things usually happen for Contractor:
1/2 Retention is released
LAD liability ceases
Maintenance period commences
Insuring obligations may cease
Warranty periods may begin
As a result Contractors are usually amenable to early handover
Your Client should be appraised of this in order for the Client to understand the decision that they have to take.
Member for
18 years 4 monthsRE: Taking over of sections or parts
hi ashraf,
one important factor in you pb is time, and that you forget to mention!
How many handovers do you foresee per day, per week,
per month?
If the 33 sections are to be completed the same week
for instance, nobody will gain anything by splitting hairs!
On the contrary if the handovers are to be spread over
a year, no doubt you should come up with a form and a routine for separate handovers!
I could imagine a weekly meeting during which the areas
completed that week would be checked, sealed, signed and delivered
hth
Member for
19 years 2 monthsRE: Taking over of sections or parts
In the condition of contract ,it is stated that if any part of the permanent works has been substantially completed and has satisfactory passed any tests on completion prescribed by the contract, the engineer may after due consultation with the employer issue a taking-over cetificate in respect to that part of the permanent works before completion of the whole of the works in condition that the contractor shall undertake to complete with due expedition any outstanding works during the defects liability period for that part.
Member for
19 years 2 monthsRE: Taking over of sections or parts
Can i get more opinion/advises from the others , please
Member for
22 years 10 monthsRE: Taking over of sections or parts
To begin with, you need to obtain a ‘Relief from Maintenance’ for every section turned-over. Without this, any damage done will still be your responsibility to repair.
Next, you need to ensure unrestricted access to the remaining work sites. You also need to establish noise level and hours guidelines. You need dust and debris guidelines. You need power interruption guidelines.
Finally, You need to establish access boundaries so that no one not in your employ will access any part of the active work area (including your entrance and access areas.) Your insurance and bounding companies need to sign off on this agreement. Without this, you will find that you have voided your contracts and coverage.
Good Luck!
Member for
19 years 2 monthsRE: Taking over of sections or parts
Did any body has share in arranging partial taking over for a project in stages and what were the guid lines and prenciples.
Member for
20 years 10 monthsRE: Taking over of sections or parts
Ashraf,
If the sections havent been previously agreed then it would appear by the wording you stated that it up to you to agree them now. This may ease your problem, assuming the contractor plays ball and agrees to fewer sections.
No doubt he will be keen to handover the sections as soon as possible for the reasons indicated in my previous post.
How does the contract define sectional completion (if it does)? eg, taken into use by the Employer or similar. Something along these lines may help you divide the project into larger sections if 2 or 3 areas will not be used until all complete.
Member for
19 years 2 monthsRE: Taking over of sections or parts
Dears,
I was deeply investigating all the contractsdocuments to find any more details and i got in the tender query and response the following-
"Partial havdover will be accepted by the client with sections to be agreed on site with the engineer."
Did the above give me any strong contractual support during my discussion and negotiation with the contractor for how to devid the project in to reasonable stages for handing over.
Member for
20 years 10 monthsRE: Taking over of sections or parts
Clive,
Totally agree. The sectional completion is probably more relevant to the Employer as it would have been the Employer for his own reasons, came up with the sectional completion requirements of the contract.
Member for
20 years 10 monthsRE: Taking over of sections or parts
Ashraf,
You can try and agree whatever you like with the contractor but as each section will pass from his insurance to yours and the issue of the partial completion certificate will possibly start the defects correction period running, I doubt (or would be very unwise to) the contractor will agree.
The contract states the deal that was made, now its up to you to carry that deal out.
Member for
19 years 2 monthsRE: Taking over of sections or parts
Dear, Clive
I need your opinion in the practicality of this process to issue 33 nos.of partial taking over certificates for one project and i said that itis contractually supported but i would like to draw your attention regarding the following:-
*To issue a paital taking over certifucate i have to do te following:-
1- Do my own inspection for the completed areas.
2- Be sure that all qualiyy tests have been done and tests results are in compliance with the contract requirements.
3- Be sure that a suitable corrective actions have been taken for any failed tests .
4- Be sure that no any major works are remaining or avoid the client form using the completed portons safely.
5- write my report and recommendations to the client.
*I have to call the client officially for handing over inspection for any completed portions.
*If the client accept my recommendation, I have to specify the handing over commitee which should include Clientsrpresentative,Engineersrpresentative and contractorsrpresentative .
*The handing over commitee shall inspect the areas to confirm wither those areas have been comlpleted to the satisfaction of the client or not.
*If the areas were ready, completed and accepted, the engineer has to issue a partial taking over certificate for those particular areas.
So is it practical to do all the above said proceedures for each completed area or we can agree with the contractor to devide the project to 5 satges (as example)for handing over so, we can reduce the nos. of partial taking over certificates and reduce the complecated process of releasing the retention amount,issuing maitanence certificates and other contractual proceedures
Member for
19 years 7 monthsRE: Taking over of sections or parts
u have to issue him a TOC as per clause 48.2 attahced with a punch list.