I want to make sure that it is very important to see whether or not his is something that is going to improve in many way.

Hi Rodel,
if we both agree that automatic adjustment of resource crews to activity duration just produce something to think about and not to accept then there is nothing to discuss. Accepting new resource requirements means recalculation of the whole schedule and not just one activity.

Specific tasks with specific timing shall be planned as specific activities, I never suggested to use partial workload for this case.
With crane you will not schedule each lift as specific activity. It may be done but the size of the schedule will become too large for easy work.

I am used to apply the term estimating to estimating of costs and durations basing on some norms and usually without considering resource limitations.

Do you agree that simulating total workload instead of both workload and quantities of assigned resources is wrong?

Best Regards,
Vladimir

Hi Rodel,
partial workload is common everywhere.
This is the way people use cranes that participate in many activities done in parallel.

Planning is not the same as estimating, planning is modelling project execution.

If we have only one welding machine the information that we need 1.2 welding machines is nice to have but cannot be accepted. In one of my previous posts I described the crew that does automatic welding. You will not need 2.4 buses, 7.2 welders and 3.6 pipelayers together with 1.2 welding machines. You can use 3 pipelayers or 6 pipelayers, not 4 and not 5.
If productivity of assigned crew is not sufficient people shall decide what can be done to accelerate the work. Two CRC machines on the same activity is nonsense. Maybe it makes sense to create new spread?

Resource assignment decisions are much more complicated than just multiplying existing assignments and make 10 welding machines do the work in one day.

It is easy to calculate necessary amount of crews for plaster work in your second example. To finish the work in 8 days you will need 1.25 crews. You want this result?
Or you will look at the whole project and will think what additional resources to use for accelerating project performance crashing critical activities most effective way? Maybe accelerating some other work will be more cost effective?

Playing with resources or technologies is natural, playing with durations is unprofessional.

You did not answer what is wrong with my examples.

I did not understand the purpose of your explanations about resource availability. We discussed the case when resources are available but are required on certain activities only part time and thus may be used on other activities in parallel (also part time).

Best Regards,
Vladimir

Hi Vladimir,
Thanks for the response. I already make a sample with spider project and I have 2 answers that are why I ask the question. If I assign all activities a calendar with their working hours, Act 3 start after act1 but if all same calendar act 3 start after act1 & act2.

I just want to clear my mind which is the best approach.

Problem two: I respect you opinion but I still opossed the idea.

Best Regards,
Rodel

Hi Rafael,
Thanks for the valuable info. I already got it before your post and again thank you, very much appreciated.

We haven’t resolved the issue and make the things more complicated.
I will re-raise my query:
Problem 1:
If Act1 start 8:00Am to 12:00PM and Act2 start 8:00AM to 2:00PM when Act3 should start working? Is it following day after Act1 & Act2 finished or Act3 will start after Act1 finished?

Problem 2:
Task driving resources (not productivity)
All projects are done by crews, sometime it can be done by individual or specialist.
Problem: if task is reduced or increase duration with fixed unit (fixed contract or fixed productivity per crew or individual) can the software calculate the resources required base on the new given durations?

Best Regards,
Rodel

Rafael,
I got it!!! It’s awesome!!! Just curious on the start of Act3. Should it be after Act1 & Act2 or Start as soon as Act1 finish?

Best Regards,
Rodel

Hi Rodel,
In the pipeline construction project CRC welding crew consists of:
6 welders, 2 riggers, 4 installers, CRC machine, 3 heavy pipelayers, 5 tractors, 11 skinners, 1 light bulldozer, 2 buses, 1 truck, 3 drivers.
Let’s suppose that you want to make activity duration 20% shorter. What quantity of crew resources will be needed?

Let’s suppose that John is assigned to do some work. How many Johns will be need if this work duration will be made 20% shorter.

Another example: some activity is done by two resources with different productivities. You increased activity duration and now it is sufficient to assign only one of these two resources. Which one will be selected by P6?

Once I was invited to estimate the schedules created in one software development company. When I asked why some person worked 49 hours per day the answer was – don’t worry, he does his work on time.

In Spider Project you can calculate necessary workload (equivalent to hours per day) of assigned resources if activity duration and resource productivities are set. But Spider will not accept the workload that exceeds 100%. The planner shall change assigned crew first.

I looked at the sample project that you sent to me. If the start date of this project will be changed all resource dates shall be adjusted manually. If resource availability is defined by schedule events defining proper dates is hard and permanent job.

Best Regards,
Vladimir

Hi Vladimir,
I opposed on your comment regarding duration drive resource assignment. In some cases it happened.
For example: Fabrication of Steel work (not cast in situ) or pipe shop welding
If 2 steelmans can fixed 7 tons of steel in fabrication yard in 10 day but I have a deadline to complete 7 tons of steel in 5 days how many resource I need?
By reducing the number of day the software should gave me an equivalent steelman.

Same as pipe shop welding. If 1 welder can complete 10 joint of 20” diameter of pipe in 10 day how many welders I need to complete in 5 days?

I agree that total hours is not precise equivalent to quantities but can mimic as equivalent.

For your example Act1 = 50% of 4 person, Act2 = 75% of 4 person, Act 3 = 100% of 4 person for crew of 10 people assignment. (my understanding with this is schedule quantity = 10 men for 8hr/day)

In P6 the setup of resource is max unit/time = 10 * 8 = 80h/d (equivalent for 10 person)
Act1 = 50% of 4 persons = 16h/d
Act2 = 75% of 4 persons = 24h/d
Act3 = 100% of 4 persons = 32h/d

If the three activities is not link together P6 will level activities either Act1 & Act2 or Act1 & Act3 or Act2 & Act3 (any combination of 2 activities) will worked parallel and one activity will be delayed because it exceed the max unit/time 80hrs/day (10 person).

Best Regards,
Rodel

Hi Vladimir,
Thanks for the response.
You said:
"If for some reason the event will happen earlier than expected resources that are created at certain time will not be available."
"If event will be delayed resources may start to be used before they are available."

Actually not exactly but similar to what I’m looking for that is why I asked the question: "In Spider Project how do you change the duration of activity without changing the limit of resources and activity will reduce or increase resource qty."

I’m looking for a Task driving the resource and not resource driving the activity.

For example:
Two activities both had crew consist of 10 men with 10 day duration each and not link to each other. Let say Act1 can start now and Act2 have constrained to start after 15 days (area will be free 15 day after). If I used a crew (10 members) and finished in 10 days my crew will idle for 5 days before I can start on Act2. If I extend the duration of Act1 to 15 days what settings should I used in Spider Project to calculate how many men should I used in 15 days instead of 10 men in 10 days?

Another scenario: Act1 = 10day with 10 men. If I make Act1 to 5 day duration what settings should I used in Spider Project to calculate number of resource required to finish Act1 in 5 day (ex: 10day/2 = 5 day = 10 men * 2 = 20 men)

I hope I explained it clear.

P6 quantity is not the workload as you mention. The workload is the limit settings (Max unit/time) and P6 unit/time assigned to activity is the % of Max unit/time defined.

In P6 settings you can change the settings of unit/time by percentage instead of unit/duration (unit/time).

Ex:
Hours Per Time Period = 8hrs/day, 40hrs/week…etc
Resource A = Crew (10 men)
Max Unit/Time = 80h/d

Act 1 = 20% = 16h/d
Act 2 = 30% = 24h/d
Act 3 = 50% = 40h/d

P6 variable resource is called resource curve and future bucket.

Best Regards,
Rodel

Rafael,
I believed spider project has a capability of exporting xer. To make sure that we are using same data I would request if you can provide me xer exported from your original data and I will do the leveling or Vladimir will do the leveling for us. I will check the correct settings if required and if possible can you provide spider format also so I can check the validity of data using demo version if you don’t mind.

Thanks & Best Regards,
Rodel

Hi Rafael,
Sorry but I not manually update the resource availability and I’m not using fixed dates that is why I explained the 4 duration types and their response when updating the values.
All profiles are calculated by software as per your sample. P6 reflects the results after leveling using the original setup that you used. How I wish I could share you the original file (xer) and let you do the leveling and how P6 calculate resource availability base on the duration types settings.

Best Regards,
Rodel

Hi Vladimir,
Correct me if I’m wrong. I believed I already answer that question on the exercise given by Rafael.
Ex:
Act1 & Act2 having same resource and not link to each other. Let say ¾ of Act1 duration limit of resources change (decrease or increase) then the software will calculate the availability of resource after leveling if Act2 can start based on the given limit as per Rafael’s sample and P6 have the same output as per Rafael screenshot.

Another scenario given is if the Act1 change duration software again will calculate resource availability base on new date and will not over allocate resource which I believed I answer using Fixed Unit/Time duration type, software will automatically adjust resource assignment based on new duration.

Best Regards,
Rodel

Hi Vladimir,
I think I finally understand the picture of you query. “I hope (:” so please guide and educate me. I will say that Rafael example is too confusing and out of the context of his lyrics on what is he trying to explain. He wrote “"I am looking for the way P6 discloses the rules and amount when resources are produced by an activity in a concise and clear way." Then you cite an example of Mobilisation which confused me more. (Sorry Rafael, my understanding thought is in dreadful wave and need some reconditioning due to other events that I’m currently working)

My understanding is this and I hope this explained what we are trying to model here.
In P6 it has 4 duration types settings that controls resource assignment which every planner must aware off. In absence of knowing the behaviour of resources base on this setting will complicate scenario or produce an expected result or error.
The duration type enables to control which variables of this equation are calculated when you change a value. The duration type applies only when resources are assigned to the activity.

1) Fixed Duration and Units – using this setting will limit the duration and units regardless of how many resources added to activity. When adding resources to activities with these settings it also complies on the calculation settings either preserve or recalculate duration, units and unit/time.
If Preserve is mark then duration will be fixed and resource unit will be calculated based on default Unit/Time which resulting to accumulated units per time period.
Ex: Activity having 5 days duration with default 8hr/d
If a resource is assigned = 5 x 8 = 40hr and if additional resources assigned it will maintain 5 day duration and add another 40hr to the remaining units = 80hr.

If Recalculate is mark then duration will be fixed and resource unit is also fixed.
Ex: same as above example 5 day duration with default 8hr/d
If a resource is assigned = 5 x 8 = 40hr and if additional resources assigned it will maintained 5 day duration and also the first default calculated units equivalent. The result will be first resource assign = 40hr divided by 2 = 20hr and unit/time became 4hr/d and soon if keep adding resources.

Update behaviour: Unit is fixed even duration change or Duration is fixed even unit change. (vice versa)
Note: Planner/User must be aware that if unit is change to a higher value the original resource max unit/time must be updated otherwise it will over allocate the resource.

2) Fixed Duration and Unit/Time – using this setting will limit the duration and Unit/Time. It kind of a reverse response of the above settings. This setting unit become variable responding to “Preserve and Recalculation” settings.
Regardless of Preserve and Recalculation is mark both response is duration fixed and unit/time is fixed therefore it will keep accumulating units based on default unit/time if resources is assigned.
Ex: as above = 5 x 8 = 40hrs. If another resource assigned then additional 40hrs = 80hrs and soon.

Update behaviour: Duration and Unit/Time is fixed
If duration is change units also change maintaining the original unit/time but if the unit or unit/time change duration will still the same or duration will be preserve.
(This setting could be a candidate for modelling the examples that you mention)

3) Fixed Units – using this setting will maintain units but duration will become variable. This setting will have opposite reaction from 2 above settings. If recalculation is mark then units will be fixed and keep dividing the durations based on unit/time but if Preserved is mark it will also preserving or maintain original durations.

Update behaviour: If duration changes, unit will stay as fixed but if unit is change duration will also change base on original unit/time. If unit/time change, unit will be fixed but duration will change based on original units over new unit/time.
Ex: as above = 5 x 8 = 40hr. If unit/time change from 8hr/d to 4hr/d then duration = 10d and unit stays at 40hr.

Note: if Unit/Time is change higher to original resource max unit/time will resulting to over allocated and prevent Primavera to level the resource.

4) Fixed Unit/Time – This setting will maintain Unit/Time, durations and Unit will become variable. This setting also has same response on Fixed Unit in regards to “Preserve and Recalculate” settings but have different response on update.

Update behaviour: Regardless of duration or Unit change it will maintain original unit/time and calculate duration or unit which ever criteria change using duration or unit over original unit/time.
Ex: same as above: 5 x 8 = 40h. If duration change from 5 to 10 then unit = from 40 to 80 or if unit change from 80 to 40 duration = from 10 to 5 (vice versa)

(This setting could be another candidate for modelling the examples that you mention)

On my opinion, modelling the scenario given will be depending on the input available.
For example: Mobilization or passing certification exams (welders on pipeline construction). If the info available is number of resource then the best way to model this scenario is using Fixed unit/time duration type. Using this setting will allow user to input number of available resources on the spot with out specifying total duration required and the software will automatically calculate total durations. Using this setting also allow user to input estimated duration and the software will calculate number of resources required base on default unit/time.

Another possible settings that can be used is Fixed Duration and Unit/Time duration type if the info available is estimated duration but I recommend Fixed Unit/Time as it is more flexible which ever info is available.

Rafael,
Sorry mate I did not forget you. Yes I tried both exercises that you did and I manage to get same result. P6 also capable of displaying Max Unit/Time on resource usage spreadsheet using the given time but different format on the screen shot that you provided. I think yours is more users friendly as shown below:



Other Exercise:
Original:

After Leveling:

After date change:


I hope this answer your query but please guide me to right direction if I’m heading to wrong path.

Best Regards,
Rodel

Rodel,
let’s wait for Rafael.
He wrote: "I am looking for the way P6 discloses the rules and amount when resources are produced by an activity in a concise and clear way."
That is why I understood that he asked about variable resource availabilities defined not by fixed dates but by project schedule.
In any case how you model this in P6?

Best Regards,
Vladimir

Hi Rodel,
if I understood Rafael correctly he asked if in P6 resource availability may depend on start or finish of certain activities in the project schedule.
Example: when mobilization will be finished some resources will become available on site, etc.

Setting dates manually does not help much when you don’t know when certain activities will be performed and resource availability depends on their execution. Besides manually defined dates shall be permanently reconsidered with the entering performance results.

Best Regards,
Vladimir