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Add New Discussion Category - Construction Schedul

12 replies [Last post]
Eric Chou
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I just found out this website not long ago. This is a great website and will have his place to stay for good.

May I suggest adding a new discussion category say "Construction Schedule".

Often time I found out a scenario in construction that people superintend the project don’t know how to present their knowledge in a CPM format. On the other hand, people who put together the CPM have no sufficient knowledge about the construction. (It certainly needs many years of experience to get familiar with all the trades.) As a result of that, I often see a CPM schedule to be not even realistic nor usable by field crew.

To solve this problem, we can use this forum to collect everybody’s input, which can be grouped by CSI Code section systematically. Hopefully, we can also have people from Subcontractors (Trade) to participate in these efforts. This can then be a place for all Schedulers, Superintendents, and Subcontractors to exchange their knowledge and views about construction schedule such as the typical construction activities and sequences.

Eventually we can somehow develop a standard to depict all construction activities which can then be utilized by all people in the industry as a reference or can also be used to train fresh staff.

Note that this discussion group will emphasize on the depiction of the construction activities, typical sequences, etc. not on any software.

For example, how do we depict an elevator construction in a schedule? How about shoring? Plaster? etc. Can we somehow create a “standard” for everybody as most estimators are using CSI master format.

We can also share the knowlege about the typical procurement time for any materials, which is often a major "risk" in the schedule.

Eric Chou, PE
HTC Project Controls, Inc.


Replies

Erik Jonker
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Joined: 19 Apr 2003
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I would not go into such detail. You will never be able to encompass all the disciplines.

I would suggest a different aproach.

A planner needs a rate, submits it to PP. You need to specify clearly what rate, units etc. you want. PP classifies it into a major type of activity.

PP sends out a voting e-mail, everybody who has signed up, recieves an voting e-mail. The person then states if it is a best guess or experience.

It would be like who wants to be a millionaire’s phone a friend.

You then can show the average, upper and lower limits of everybody’s guesses. You would just have to split the Split the answers into calculated and wild guesses.

Would certainly brighten up many people’s days, to see how close their guesses are.

Cheers

Erik
Andrew Ng
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Joined: 3 Jul 2004
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Dear Gents,

I support your ideas all the way.

If there are demands for informations on like construction sequence and productivity on railway and related works, I am sure our members would be glad to contributes with whatever experience and knowledge they have, esp :-

a) signalling systems design and installations;

b) traction power systems design and installation, eg Overhead catenary system or third rails system;

c) tracklaying and railway related communication systems - design and construction.

d) other railway related civil construction like overhead bridge, level crossings, depots and other maintenance facilities.

Of course the sequence and complexity of these works may again be subcategorised according to whichever level of the rail transport speed they fall under, eg:-

a) High speed Trains like TGV, Shinkansen or Siemens Transrapid or Mag-Lev Trains;

b) Metros, MTR, MRT or like wise;

c) LRT’s

d) Intercity Express or Commuter Services;

e) Monorails, Trams, People Movers and other Intra City Low Speed Systems.

I seem to gather from the feedback from participants of a seminar in HK recently that there was no possiblity of finding reliable information of such nature in the public domains.

Would welcome any suggestion and contribution to the site once set up by the moderator.

Best Regards



Andrew Huang
....Kaohsiung Taiwan......
www.project-resources.com

Forum Guest
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Hi PPers,

If you guys can work together to come up with your requirements (there’s loads of great ideas here) we will get them put into action.

The problem that we have at PP is moving issues forward, i.e. to turn a good idea, into something that we can put on the web for us planners.

Regards.
Christine Miller
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All,

I think this is a marvelous idea, particularly for those of us who are just starting as planners in the construction/engineering community.

I’d be particularly interested in hearing from planners with experience in scientific laboratory buildouts, both cGMP and cGLP compliant. Also: Biosafety Level 2,3,and 4 suite construction, autoclave installations, office to laboratory conversions...

Thanks so much for suggesting this!

Regards,
Christine
Raj Maurya
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Posts: 132
I support Daya’s advise, we can have broad category like Process plant, Steel plant, oil & gas... etc then we can sub - categorise it like Compressor Package, process piping,pipe line etc.
Dayanidhi Dhandapany
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in addition to Shahzad,

add

A. Processing Plants
B. Pipeline
etc......
Shahzad Munawar
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Hi Chou

Your idea is good but this idea should be implemented under following heads so that each one get more benefits from it and mould this schedule as per his own site conditions.

1. Airports - chronological activities details
2. Roads covering all aspects of Road Construction
3. Bridges with all structures
4. Marine Works
5. High Rise and Commercial Buildings (Heavy Civil Construction)
6. Infrastructure associated schedules
7. others
Eric Chou
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Dear all,

Sorry to get back to you just now as I have been busy with my work. Here is an example that we can share with each other:

Single Geared-Traction Elevator (CSI Section 14200) Typical Construction Sequence:

1. Hoist and Set Machine Beams
2. Material Handling
3. Hoist & Set Machines
4. Install Rails & Brackets
5. Install Entrances
6. Install Sling, Platform, Weights & Ropes
7. Install Wiring Fixtures, Hoistway
8. Install Car Assembly
9. Adjustment & Testing
10. Clean Up

One thing to mention here is the elevator erection is not proceeding on a floor by floor basis. Typically, the elevator installation does not start until the hoistway is complete and the machine room is waterproofed. Nevertheless, elevator sub will need to set overhead support beams prior to pouring the machine room floor slab, and conduct all construction survey of the hoistway before the erection, etc.

Again, this is a typical sequence. The schedulers should always refer to the plans and specs, and subcontractors to depict the specific sequence, and the appropriate level of detail for your project. I don’t think we need to suggest activity durations as they will vary a lot per the size of the project.

I think schedulers will benefit a lot by just sharing the above basic information. I think the existing Forum layout is good enough, maybe just add a column (field) for filling in the CSI section. The existing title block can be used to fill in the generic construction category such as Elevator, Pile Driving, etc.

Eric Chou, PE
HTC Project Controls, Inc.
Forum Guest
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Hi there PPers,

We are working on something along these lines. Does anyone have any draft sequence-lists to kick start this issue?

There are many ways in which we could make this work. How can it work with the forum facility? Should it be a simple page with lists.

Suggestion required please.
Tomas Rivera
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I vote for Eric´s proposal very highly. I myself have first hand field experience on many disciplines; but in some instances, I am doubtful about the real or correct construction sequence. This is especially the case because almost all my schedules are very detailed schedules, for which I need to know the exact way a group of activities are usually executed.

Some times you do not have the proper people readily available to clarify your doubts, or it might be the case that you do not have the time to go and look for them. In these cases this new category would be very useful.

On the other hand, Eric is very right. Many planners do not have the necessary field experience to be able to depict a schedule that resembles the reality on the job. I think this proposed new category would be very useful for many.

To summarize, planners need two fundamental capabilities: planning knowledge and field knowledge. I should add that I am talking about the correct way a certain activity should be done on a jobsite. There is a good number of cases in which workers do not execute a certain group of activities using the proper procedure. There are several or many professional organizations that produce standards for executing construction tasks or activities. There are also installation instructions by the manufacturers of construction materials or equipment. People on the field should execute their activities the proper way. If this new category is going to be added, and to be able to have some kind of order, I would suggest to reference as many participations as possible to a standard or a manufacturer instruction.

Thank you
Dayanidhi Dhandapany
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Dear Eric, I welcome your approach, Also if there is a place to upload construction schedules in p3 format to depict the sequence of work in the discussion forum, then it would be more meaningful. Regards Daya
Forum Guest
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you may want to take a look at the productivity-rates section.